snafui
Seasoned Citizen
Posts: 169
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Post by snafui on Feb 1, 2007 0:02:28 GMT -5
Again, original documentation shows that the addition to that verse is an interpolation, not different translations. I didn't say it was different in translations I said in original documents.
As far as the other verses go, they are not talking about walking on the earth, the Mystery Cults had stories along this line, that doesn't mean it's refering to a historical event. Christianity was the one to add a historical figure via the Gospels.
That the Gospels were written by actual disciples is not a fact, it is in dispute because of their dating. The books selected for the New Testament were selected, not arbitrarily, but by design, by humans that wanted to convey their own beliefs. They were selected by men at their whim.
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Post by guerrillasaint on Feb 2, 2007 13:44:50 GMT -5
Most Christian hear about God by word of mouth. That is how my dad was lead to the “fold“. Still he doesn’t believe because someone told him to. If the bible didn't exist today the word of God would still go out. The fact that there is a Bible just means that we know a lot of what God wants and we are responsible for know it. Some of the things I know about God didn't come me reading the bible. I received lessons directly from God which were confirmed by the Bible The first convers didn't really see themselves as breaking off from the Jewish traditions or religion they were just moving along to the next step. The reason why we probably aren't just another sect of Jews is because they allowed Gentiles in to the religion. Some Jews couldn't handle that because gentiles are unclean. As for me I met God before I could even read so the Bible meant nothing to me. There was no need for me to have the Bible to believe.
I believe I had one but why do I need to read it?
Yes it would be a cop-out if that is why I did it. I want to knows why he is an expert in this field. Just having a degree doesn't make anyone an expert. I have a degree in Art but I can't clam to be an expert on Picasso and start re-dating his work. I would have to have a great deal of sources to explain my hypothesis, which I found that Mr. Doherty didn't do. Many people would be skeptical of my sparsely sourced hypothesis about Picasso and I am skeptical of his sparsely sourced hypothesis. Since you believe in his work please explain to me why his work is credible? I went to his website by the way that is why I was so surprised that he didn't site that much. He didn't explain his expertise.
So if you don't mind would you explain to me what makes him a expert? Why is he an expert of on dating documents of the Bible? Was he actually able to look a the original documents of the bible? Why can't you put Mark in the 50-70 A.D.? How long has he been studding the Bible? Who backed him up and why are they credible? What brought up this hypothesis in the first place?
Did you study revelations along with you other source to come to this conclusion? How many times did you go over revelations?
How many other kings wore purple robes? Purple is a royal color. Also when they talk about someone wearing purple it is a woman and she was the " THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" Rev 17:5 (KJV) Now there are cities how sale purple fabric Rev 18:12 and the city is clothed in purple fabric Rev 18:16 but no man was clothed in purple.
What are you talking about?
Yes Christianity is a religion and I don't worship religion I worship God. That is the difference.
Where are your sources for these statements?
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snafui
Seasoned Citizen
Posts: 169
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Post by snafui on Feb 6, 2007 10:56:05 GMT -5
Yes, a most reliable method of learning, unfortunately that's crap; that would cause serious confusion and is why they would need it to be written. Even with the Gospels available today people can't get it straight on what the Bible says and does not say. The Biblical illeteracy is pathetically high among those that profess to be Christian. Word of mouth is rarely reliable.
Because then you will see how some books are in and others out, it was not some divine guidance on the people that chose the Canon, it was at their whim. Keep in mind the apocrypha is just what survived and was not destroyed by the Church. While you are at it read some criticism on the Bible and Christianity.
Because he has a brain and can think for himself. Read his books and see exactly what he has to say and why he says it.
I've read Revelations countless times and still think it's garbage used to create fear in people and keep them needing the Church. I have been to many, many seminars on the subject and have read several books for it's prophecy and those that say it's about Nero.
Can't look it up now but the female reference is to something other than Nero. Being clothed in purple is a reference that I had to go by memory, I moved recently and still can't find that book that I'm listing these from. Once I do, I'll go into more detail for you.
For the interpolation both Doherty and Acharya S talk about it. For the other statements read various criticisms on the subject and you will find many that say those things.
That is not a difference. That is your personal feelings on the matter. That does not equate Christianity to some sigularity of truth and righteousness. In one of the books I'm reading one of the articles points out that Christianity has no original beliefs to it - that Christians borrowed all it's aspects from other religions to build their own.
Surely you jest. There are verses in the Bible that state that if you don't get it, it's just something you cannot understand, Proverbs 3:5 comes to mind. And how many times does the Bible rely on this "he that has an ear, let him hear." This is a typical ploy of religions; if you don't get it, it's your own problem, but we are right and you should just believe what we say.
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Post by guerrillasaint on Feb 6, 2007 17:05:51 GMT -5
They did have scripture they have the Jewish Bible the Tanakh. The apostles knew it and studied it so they could talk to the Jews about God and Jesus. There are a number of scriptures talking about the coming of the messiah which they probably used to help them understand. Also they have the use of the Holy Spirit (which is a great help at communicating salvation because He is God). Now I am not going to say that there wasn't some confusion but people got the message. Actually Paul was a Pharisee so he knew the scripture. remember Jesus said the didn’t come to change the law but to fulfill it. So they had no reason to really break from the Jewish traditions.
If I am not mistaken but didn't the church go over every word in the bible and voted on ever word . Also they choose which ones were acceptable by cross referencing them. If they didn't fit in or weren't backed up by the others they were not included in the Holy Bible. I know that there were a number of books out there at the time. It was committee that voted on the bible not just one person so it would be hard to just throw something in or out because of whim.
Hummm? Now if I gave you this reason for a person to be an expert would you think that was enough proof? I seems to me that you have a lot of faith in this man but only because he backs up your beliefs. So what happen to being skeptical and questioning everything? Why haven't you checked out this guy’s credibility before you decide to back up his statements. This isn't a matter of opinion this is a matter of where you are going to spend the rest of eternity. If I was going to base my beliefs of this man I would know why he was an expert. He should be backed but some great people. You should allow you soul to be thrown away so frivolously.
Acharya S now she can be considered a expert by the definition. Still even though she seems right since I am not an expert and can't explain to you how she is right or wrong or partially right and wrong. Luckily I don’t put my faith in humans. I don't know enough about what she is talking about. (I do know a good lie has at least some truth in it.) Also I know that my God is not a figment of my imagination and that He wasn't made up by others because I knew him before I knew what Christianity was. He is my genesis not Christianity. I talk to him daily so that balks in the face of him just being a myth.
There is a big difference. My definitions of religion is that it is a way to go about something. It is a set of rules, traditions and rituals that people govern their life by. You can be religious about anything. I am not going to live or die by Christianity. Christianity is man made like any other religion. God is not man made. He has been with me for a very long time and he has told me about Jesus and the Holy Spirit. I have come to know more about God through Christianity but I do not worship Christianity. I do not worship the Bible they are just tools that I use in my walk with God. That is what the difference is.
I don't understand what you mean where you talk about "he that has an ear, let him hear" and you have only quoted half of the scripture. In all the scriptures that He that hath a ear, let him hear what he spirit has to say unto the churches.(and that is still half you can see entire verse in Rev 2:7,11,17,29;3:6,13,22) So this is talking about all those who belong to the church and have accepted Jesus or they won't be able to hear what the Spirit has to say. Also he is trying to draw your attention to something. Not saying that if you don't get it o-well. Also in Proverbs 3:5 “Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.” This is talking about trust in the Lord because he knows all and our understanding is flawed and we can't possible know everything. So use God as your compass because he is always right. Also it even says if you are wondering then just ask Him. Jas 1:5 “If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.” That doesn't sound like a tough titty attitude to me.
I didn't read all of revelations until you talked about it. I can also say that I am not afraid of what is going on in verse. It is more interesting than scary to me.
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Post by guerrillasaint on Feb 6, 2007 17:11:07 GMT -5
(Acharya S in reference to what she talks about.) Every religion looks similar on the surface it is when you dive in is where things start to look a lot different. The devil will use everything he can to trip you up. If you don't know the truth then he has got you right where he wants you.
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