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Post by necroshine on Sept 2, 2005 16:29:32 GMT -5
The tsunami happened and hundred's of people died. The hurricane happened last week and hundred's of people died. That is an act of nature and people die everyday due to nature. This is nothing new. And will happen over and over again until the earth is no longer around.
But Christians call it an "act of god" then I see a preacher on tv praying for help from god for the victims of the flood.
I think we have already seen enough "acts of god" for one life time. We don't need any more. I have a suggestion for god. Go away and leave us alone.
In the words of Dave Mustang.. "the world doesn't want to be saved …. Only left alone"
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Post by vertigo on Sept 2, 2005 19:41:02 GMT -5
They will thumb suck any stupid rubbish to make God sound good. It isn't remotely rational, and one is deluded if one thinks otherwise. So don't even indulge them with rational discussion. Just be honest and tell them they aren't invited. They can take their rubbish and (leave).
Edit: Euphemised the post, don't want to anger the mods.
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Post by vertigo on Sept 2, 2005 19:50:26 GMT -5
Oh, one more thing, Dave Mustaine is a Christian. Listen to 'I thought I knew it all' off the same CD.
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Post by necroshine on Sept 3, 2005 7:39:23 GMT -5
i do not get that he is a Christian from that song. i use to go to the megadeth board a while ago. i know that dave is more spiritual now than he was in the past but that is not to say that he is “Christian” just spiritual. I find a difference in the two.
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Post by necroshine on Sept 3, 2005 7:39:59 GMT -5
plus i don't care what he is, i still like the music.
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Post by vertigo on Sept 3, 2005 10:45:38 GMT -5
Spiritual means believing in things you can't see, believing in mumbo-jumbo. There's no significant difference. Anyhow, he is a Christian (he said so himself).
I like the music, but I certainly care if he spreads the cult. He has seen the depravity/fickleness of humans, and so I think turns to God as a crutch. It is a mistake. All is not permitted without God.
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The Reservoir Dog
Seasoned Citizen
I'm sick of following my dreams, I'm just gonna ask where they're goin' and meet up with em' later.
Posts: 136
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Post by The Reservoir Dog on Sept 3, 2005 11:45:27 GMT -5
Another point is that if the hurricane is an "act of god", that means he did it deliberatly because it was his act; so why pray for his help if he did it on purpose? That makes absolutly no sense what so ever.
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Post by vertigo on Sept 3, 2005 14:26:16 GMT -5
And telling people that will have no effect, none whatsoever, because it isn't true that their religion has a rational basis. It is not the case that it is possible to fight religion with rational discussion and argument.
This type of discussion only serves to bolster the ego of atheists, which is stupid anyhow because it is so elementary.
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Post by necroshine on Sept 3, 2005 16:21:44 GMT -5
then what is your suggestion on talking to christians? do you even think you sould try? and if not then what do you do with them? what The Reservoir Dog said is what i am getting at with this post. why ask for gods help when he did this to begain with? the christians call it an act of god so why ask for his help?
i agree with you that this is a bit juvenile but like all things that are juvenile it is fun to see a christian stand there with a blank look on the face when you say something like that. for that one second i know they are questioning the idea of god. if only for that one second.
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Post by vertigo on Sept 3, 2005 18:59:03 GMT -5
I used to think that the thing to do was to be understanding, open, etc. I used to think that if we come across sincerely the results will be forthcoming. I tried to do that, especially on this site. I can honestly say that I haven't seen even one Christian who changed their tune after participating here, and I don't think it is possible.
What happens is Christians come here pretending to be seeking information, when all they are doing is looking for a place to preach. They are not coming here in good faith, with sincerity.
When folks like B33 post mounds of propaganda, what do we do? We politely ask questions. We engage such people as though it would make any difference. Sure, we might imagine that it would be of help to other people who read it, but I don't think it helps at all.
People leave religion not because atheists put forward convincing arguments, and that's the point I am trying to make. This whole exercise of engaging theists politely is a futile effort. We should rightly engage them with scorn, with derision even. We should draw comparisons to Hitler, etc, as I did with GuerillaSaint. We should leave a clear impression that we don't respect people who believe in fairy tales, that we view them with contempt.
So let me now say, in no uncertain terms, to all Christians who are reading this, I don't like you. You pervert society with no regard for anyone else, you look down on me from your moral high ground, you perpetuate mob justice, and at the same time profess to be doing it in anybody's interest but your own. Damn you.
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Post by necroshine on Sept 3, 2005 19:46:42 GMT -5
dude if you have something to say, just say it! lol
i feel the same way as you do. when i debate with a wall i'm not trying to change the wall. like you said that is not going to happen. but when other people read the post i hope they get it. i know the christian isn't going to but maybe someone will that isn't posting. but i have to agree with you. it is a lost cause to argue with them.
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Post by solidsquid on Sept 4, 2005 14:31:24 GMT -5
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Post by necroshine on Sept 4, 2005 16:15:32 GMT -5
agreed!!
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The Reservoir Dog
Seasoned Citizen
I'm sick of following my dreams, I'm just gonna ask where they're goin' and meet up with em' later.
Posts: 136
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Post by The Reservoir Dog on Sept 10, 2005 21:20:11 GMT -5
Vertigo I don't use arguments like I post on this Forum to try to change anybody, because as you said it would be pointless. I use them because as necroshine said "it is fun to see a christian stand there with a blank look on the face when you say something like that." it provides me with entertainment. I love watching pushy theists squirm in an uncomfortable debate.
However, I do not have contempt for all christians; I only have contempt for the preachy ones. I agree that people like B33 and guerillasaint need to be stopped but the fact of the matter is we can't stop them. We can only throw so much truth and logic at them that they just get pissed off and leave.
I would also like to state for the record that I don't go out looking for theists to argue with I think that kind of behavior definitely qualifies as juvenile
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Post by vertigo on Sept 11, 2005 5:05:10 GMT -5
Reservoir Dog, perhaps you misunderstand me. I was a Christian myself. When I say we should rightly have contempt for theists, I mean we should have contempt for them as theists, for their attitude. We should have contempt for the choice they make, and for them insofar as they choose it.
Whether God exists or not, one should use their own mind. If God is good, he would appreciate autonomous people. If God is truly a slave master as they say, we should rightly not obey him. If God wants slaves, he is not worth obeying or worshipping. We should rightly have contempt for him.
And to those who would graciously be slaves, we should show them the same contempt. We judge people by their choices, that is what I am advocating. Believing in unseen, unprovable assumptions is worthy of contempt. We should show them the contempt they are worthy of.
And if they decide it makes no sense and decide to live their life without God, we should rightly show them respect.
Lastly, I don't like people who surround themselves by inferiority so they can be king of the hill. That is what is juvenile. The reason people laugh at inferiority is they want to publically distance themselves from it. They want to make it known that they are so much above that level. Whereas their actions should sufficiently show them as above that level, they put on an act for people to see.
"Look at how superior I am!" No doubt everyone as an individual is inferior in many ways (no one is perfect after all), so why laugh at the inferiority of others? Seek to eliminate your own inferiority, don't hide it behind acts of bravado.
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