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Post by Griffey on Nov 10, 2003 15:08:31 GMT -5
You know those Darwin Fish? (The Jesus fish with legs for those who don't.) Well I've been thinking about those lately and I have a few questions. 1. Does anyone think those fish might be disrespectful to the Christian religion? Or do you think they're a funny piece of satire? 2. And probably the question I really wanna ask, doesn't it seem kind of screwed up that evolution supporters have to make their logo-mascot-thing a rip-off of a Christian symbol? Shouldn't we have our own, original icon? (Is there one already... ) Please tell me what you think, I'm really curious about how other people view those fish.
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Post by Maverick on Nov 10, 2003 15:26:49 GMT -5
Griffey
I think the evolve fish is definitely a satire of the Christian fish symbol. Is it disrespectful to Christianity? Perhaps. But remember, satirical symbols are meant to poke fun at someone or something. It is impossible to make fun of something and not offend someone.
I guess a better question to ask is, "Are such symbols malicious towards Christians?" I don't think they are.
Griffey
First of all, if it is a satire, it makes sense that the evolve fish resembles the Christian fish. Otherwise, how would you satirize the Christian fish?
Second, the fish symbol isn't original to Christianity. If I remember correctly, that same symbol means "womb" in Greek. (Someone correct me if I am wrong.)
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Post by AuntieSocial on Nov 10, 2003 18:04:08 GMT -5
Griffey Better question ... do you think the Jesus fish might be disrespectful to the pagan fertility goddesses? I think any embelleshment to one's automobile is simply a personal statement. (I have an Evolve Fish on my truck. BTW, my truck's name is Daemon the Demon Dakota ... Obviously I don't take much of the religious symbology seriously) If you would like to see a symbol that would definately be considered more disrespectful of Christianity, scroll down to the Procreate Fish (17th emblem down in the left column). American Atheists has adopted an atomic symbol with an 'A' in the middle as a symbol for atheism. As far as the 'darwin' and 'evolve' fish being rip-ofs of Christianity, you have to keep in mind that there is nothing in Christianity that is unique to Christianity. Here's an article about the origins of the fish symbol A Fish Story
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Post by Maverick on Nov 10, 2003 18:52:41 GMT -5
You mean you don't have this one on the back of your truck yet?
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Post by AuntieSocial on Nov 10, 2003 20:01:07 GMT -5
I thought I would show some decorum for once in my life ...
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Post by Griffey on Nov 10, 2003 20:15:16 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm aware of that fish...those fishes...uh... right. I wouldn't put them on my truck though (she says as though she has a truck...) I really found your feedback about the fish not being originally Christian very helpful, I didn't know about that. Although it doesn't surprise me now that I think of it. I will have to look into some of your guys' bits about "womb" and the Pagan fertility goddess, it sounds interesting to me, and quite likely, since as I understand it Christianity ripped quite a lot of of Pagans even if they deny it. I still would like to see supporters of evolution have our own, unique symbol. Perhaps something involving a finch, since Darwin seemed to like them so much.
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Post by AuntieSocial on Nov 10, 2003 21:20:13 GMT -5
Well, Griffey, why don't you take it on as a project ... come up with some concepts and post them on this board ... I'd love to see anything you come up with.
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Post by nonny on Nov 20, 2003 0:15:58 GMT -5
You know those Darwin Fish? (The Jesus fish with legs for those who don't.) Well I've been thinking about those lately and I have a few questions. 1. Does anyone think those fish might be disrespectful to the Christian religion? Or do you think they're a funny piece of satire? Yes, to both, it is like Halloween, well the orginal halloween, it is ment to make fun of them! It is also sorta to prove a point, i mean don't you think the HUGE christian fish, are kinda mocking to us? and they do it intentionally some times.
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Post by Hilly on Nov 22, 2003 21:28:53 GMT -5
I have a 'Pagan' Fish on my truck, and have seen an Evolve Fish once here in the small city where I live. I do see many Jesus Fish. I think the reason I display it is to remind the fundamentalists that not everyone follows their doctrine, and yes some thinking people may even question it. I also display it as I am somewhat of a open atheist and hope to encourage others to be more open by example. To date I`ve had only one reaction to my fish, this by a co-worker (a born again christian) whom I carpool with. He is a bible literalist and I thought he was going to faint the day he first saw it.
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Post by nonny on Dec 1, 2003 20:30:31 GMT -5
Actully that fish was first painted on catholic's shirts so they could tell each other apart, so it is laughable for christians to have one.
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KEvb0
Maverick's Chew Toy
Posts: 21
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Post by KEvb0 on Dec 3, 2003 0:40:48 GMT -5
I don't think a darwin fish on a car could be any more offensive than "In God We Trust" on a penny... We have to live in a world saturated with religious proselytizing, why can't atheists do the same if they choose? If religious symbols are ok, than anti-religious symbols should be as well. If one has unshakeable faith than it shouldn't matter what someone says or displays, they can just turn their cheek.
I like to think that if someone can wear something as offensive as a confederate flag t-shirt, than I should be able to display any kind of anti-religious sentiment that I want.
At least atheism can't be blamed for war, oppression, slavery, genocide...
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Post by AuntieSocial on Jan 4, 2004 19:07:39 GMT -5
Although I agree that science and religion are often seen as opposing theories, I do not display my Evolve Fish as an anti-religious sentiment. I am, first and foremost, a secularist. I do not begrudge the theist of his/her warm & fuzzy security blanket, as long as they don't push their religious dogma on me.
I display my Evolve Fish only because I believe that evolution has and is occurring.
Evolution, in itself, is not opposed to all religions. Yes, it appears to be contradictory to Judaic, Christian and Islamic doctrines, but many ancient tribal beliefs had humanity coming out of the primordial sea. Certain Mayan and Aztec creation myths involve the first man being found on the shores by a god who then breathed life into this being. This is almost a melding of the "Yahweh" traditions and evolution. This idea also predates the discovery of evolution (as we know it) and the Judeo-Christian-Islam religions. Also, Christian apologists are trying hard to show that evolution could be factored into their religious doctrines as well.
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Jewel
Broken-in Plebe
I don't want the world, I just want your half.
Posts: 80
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Post by Jewel on Mar 15, 2004 13:45:57 GMT -5
I just got a bumper sticker that says, "Born OK the First Time." Should I add that to my bumper? LOL Remember, I live in the bible belt (North Cackalacky).
Jewel
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Post by pieisgood on Mar 15, 2004 21:19:55 GMT -5
I am laughing SO hard right now. I LOVE it, Jewel! That is EXACTLY what I've been trying to say to lots of theists who attack me; just I couldn't put it in words. Not only is it in words, it's in pretty funny words. definetly YES.
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Post by Griffey on Mar 18, 2004 23:49:56 GMT -5
Hey, y'all, sorry about my absence, I was off on business.
I'm a big fan of that bumper sticker, actually. My personal favorite is "I believe in life before death." Well, my favorite religious-related one, anyhow. "One nation under surveilance" is good too.
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