What Is Wrong???

[A Souless Demon]

everyone here that is trying to prove that atheist is the right way and theist is the wrong way... well make good points ok. like most of these points i cant even read the first sentence its so obliviously boring. you dont have to talk in an intelectual manner to get a point across, your vocabulary doesnt have to be that of a genius just to state your position.

well heres the deal, i have been an atheist for a few years now. if you would like to hear how i became one, please read on.

Ever since i was a kid i was raised in a different type of environment. My cousins and mostly all immediate family were strick christians, always going to church. I thought church to be boring. our family was different, we never went to church... i learned to swear from hearing it from my parents... and when i said those swears i got in trouble but eventually my parents gave up and now it is part of my every day vocabulary... (even though i will restrict myself from using it on these boards).

Well, i suppose my parents thought all of us kids were getting too "evil" if you will. (they thought i was the devil himself i was so bad sometimes). Well, they started taking us to church and holy crap that was the most boring stuff i have ever seen in my LIFE! I started running away on sundays and my parents would chase me. They would say, FINE if you dont want to go to church you can sit on the front step until we get back... mind you it was pretty cold, and i said ok i will. (i hated church that much) well they tried to force me to go anyways.

My parents soon saw that our young minds have been corrupted so we stopped attending our church (thank goodness).

When i was about 11 or 12, i was having some thoughts. "if it says in the bible that god created everything, then who created god, he can not just EXIST" and "if there was a god and he created us, why would he let us suffer so much, does he get his jolly kicks out of it"... and things like that.

There is one thing though that i DO believe in... stronger forces. I believe in poltergeists being able to use their energy to do things here on our planet, i also believe in the existence of another life in the galaxy. i am not saying i believe in little green men, just that the galaxy is SOOO amazingly massive... and if we have life on earth, why not another planet in another galaxy? there has to be life on some other planet im sure of it... are these aliens here with us now? no probably not.

Just recently when i was waiting at the bus stop for my bus to school, (this happened 3 days in a row too) some bible humpers come up to me and try to preach about the lord and they give me pamphlets and try to offer me the bible... well this one lady and i had an interesting discussion about atheism... and she said "our body's are so complex, only a greater force (god) could have created them"... and i said, no lady, evolution did that... we are very much the same as an ape, just no thumb on our feet and less hair... like evolution is the answer... if you think about it our earth has been here for BILLIONS of years. is this not enough time for a single celled organism to evolve into what we see before us today? (mind you a few eras ago, we didnt even exist, so how did we all of a sudden come to "be") also in the bible, it states god first of all made adam and eve or w/e... well, he could not have made the first man due to the fact that man hasnt existed for the past 100,000 years.

sure there are tons of contradicting statements we can all make... but if you look at it hard enough, religion is very faulted... you can argue with a religion more than you can with an atheist who doesnt have one. science i think is a big contribution to atheists and their theories.

if you have read this far i am amazed that you could have stayed awake. (unless you have read any of these other posts which are quite lengthy and hard to read while staying awake)

[Theodore Doxford]

I cannot see any reason to believe in the supernatural,stronger forces,or anything else like that..sorry

[A Souless Demon]

i did not say you have to believe in supernatural or more intelligent forces... but i sure as hell believe them.

think about this one for a minute:
ALIENS:
there is life, on earth, in this solar system, in this galaxy. space is said to be infinite, who knows where it ends? who knows IF it ends? what if the edge of space is a time warp or another dimension. we wont know. but we do know space is BILLIONS and BILLIONS of light years long. (a light year is the time it takes for light to travel for one year)

now, if there is life on earth, doesnt it occur that there is a possability to be life on another planet somewhere in this galaxy? We may never know the answer to this, but i believe there is other life out there... possibly more inteligent, possibly just micro organisms. whichever the case, they are aliens, and i believe them to be out there although im not saying you have to.

and about poltergeists... i have seen some shit in my life that science can not explain. can you explain the slamming of doors without any windows open for a draft? can you explain objects sliding off perfectly level counters and objects such as clocks and paintings being pushed off walls and landing 10 feet from where they hung? can you explain the mysterious movement of a rocking chair when no one was sitting in it, or the tv turning off and on for no apparent reason? I have seen things, and heard things, that science can surely not explain, which is why i believe in the things i do.

you do not have to believe this, and i will not try to make you believe it... i guess it all comes down to the individual and their experiences in life. also, to believe in aliens you would have to have your mind really thinking about the larger perspective of life which not everyone is capable of doing. some people are facinated with things here on our earth, such as big foot or nessie... but i suppose i am just curious in other things... i let my mind wander. but i know (or at least strongly believe) there is no god.

[ToxicMoon]

ALIENS:
there is life, on earth, in this solar system, in this galaxy. space is said to be infinite, who knows where it ends? who knows IF it ends? what if the edge of space is a time warp or another dimension. we wont know. but we do know space is BILLIONS and BILLIONS of light years long. (a light year is the time it takes for light to travel for one year)

I agree with you. I believe space is entirely too large to NOT have life somewhere else. We just currently lack the technology to go far enough out there to really discover other lifeforms. I also don't think most of the earth's population would even be ready to discover it, for we're still killing our own species. Can you imagine how horrible we'd be to other intelligent ( if you could call us that ) lifeforms?

and about poltergeists... i have seen some shit in my life that science can not explain. can you explain the slamming of doors without any windows open for a draft? can you explain objects sliding off perfectly level counters and objects such as clocks and paintings being pushed off walls and landing 10 feet from where they hung? can you explain the mysterious movement of a rocking chair when no one was sitting in it, or the tv turning off and on for no apparent reason? I have seen things, and heard things, that science can surely not explain, which is why i believe in the things i do.

A Souless Demon, do you believe it is possible to believe in spirits, reincarnation, and such without believing in god?

By the way, this isn't a question to start an argument, but merely what you said there sparked my curiousity on what your view is on that particular subject and I would love to hear you explain that a little bit more.

[A Souless Demon]

well yes i believe in spirits without the belief of god. right now you are alive. some people with special gifts claim they can see your "ora" (a glowing light around your body)

your body is made up of energy, and i believe, when you die, your energy is released. i am not sure where this energy goes, my best guess is another dimension. but for some reason, some evil spirits stay here on earth and use the energy they are made up of to do bad things to people. some people claim they are not ready to leave yet because they have unfinished business to take care of and they cant be put to rest until then. i am not sure if this is true or if they just wanna stay here or what. some people think god is energy like spirits, yet he uses his powers for good. i do not believe spirits can make items magically appear or change the future or w/e like ppl claim god can, i merely believe they can move objects around on earth (which may hurt someone, like a knife being hurled) and that they can take over someone's body and control their actions and thinking.

and about the alien thing, if we did discover them it would be amazing. we do not have to travel to discover them, we can merely use our eyes through telescopes to do so but i dont think our telescopes are powerful enough. also, if we did manage some time in the FAR FAR future to be able to come in contact with these life forms, i would fear we would end up destroying them (as long as they aren't more inteligent or a threat to us) due to our violent nature towards one another. we cant even keep our planet peacefull from war and racism and hatred, so how would we accept these other life forms? but you know what, i doubt that we will ever come in contact with aliens, but i know they are out there. (and is it true that you cant travel the speed of light without achieving infinite mass and colapsing in on yourself and creating a black hole? because then this would definetly prove my point of us not comming in contact with other creatures) i mean, so many movies and stuff illustrate aliens with flying saucers (and some ppl here on earth claim to have seen them)... and that roswell crash... so if traveling at the speed of light is impossible, then maybe they use teleportation? interesting to think about.

wanna hear my theory? i think that the roswell crash was real, there is a huge conspiracy with the government and they are trying to cover it up. they are creating air crafts with alien technology strickly for space travel. I believe they have men on these missions that are so top secret, they would kill anyone just to not let their secret out. and that they do selective brainwashing on some of the pilots that test these aircrafts so they cant remember what happened to them (after they are done using them). and these pilots would be under so much pressure and stress from flying an aircraft at such high speeds and maneuvers. well thats what i believe the government is doing right now, and i believe that roswell crash was real. and if you think that my talking about aliens is totally unrelated to atheism, your wrong. atheists believe in no god (no greater intellectual being that created us). i dont believe aliens created us, but i think there may be more intellectual aliens out there... and also ones not as smart as we are.

[EvenThen]

Ha. Now no one can make fun of me for believing in God.

[A Souless Demon]

how do you figure that? no one can make fun of you for believing in god? also, who is making FUN of you... i dont see anyone laughing... just that most of the people on this board would agree that your belief is wrong

[vertigo]

EvenThen, people aren't all the same. You have to take the good with the bad.

You are here to preach, there's no point in denying that, you are just very subtle. Why else would you come here, if not to prove your faith?

It is not anything bad, it is to be expected. To be a good Christian you must spread the word. Christians are motivated by guilt.

At least you are more forthcoming than most other Christians. I do think that it is virtually impossible for a Christian not to be judgemental. Any such person that believes they don't judge is lying to themselves.

[A Souless Demon]

well, the atheists are here not so much to prove their faith, but to share their experiences and theories with one another to back up their beliefs, theists are on here basically to prove their faith and to tell atheists their beliefs are wrong... which in fact, is not right to tell someone what they believe is wrong. no one knows the truth, so you can't say its wrong.

[EvenThen]

Christians are motivated by guilt.

I am not. Works do not get me into heaven.

[Papsmearmycat]

Well, i suppose my parents thought all of us kids were getting too "evil" if you will. (they thought i was the devil himself i was so bad sometimes). Well, they started taking us to church and holy crap that was the most boring stuff i have ever seen in my LIFE! I started running away on sundays and my parents would chase me. They would say, FINE if you dont want to go to church you can sit on the front step until we get back... mind you it was pretty cold, and i said ok i will. (i hated church that much) well they tried to force me to go anyways.

You could've avoided writing this entire paragraph by simply writing"I am a moron." No one cares that you had to sit in the cold. Quit being a pussy. "boo-hoo, i had to go to church one day." Shut up and grow some balls. We all have to do things we dislike every day. Thats life. The only reason we have to do things this way is because we made bad choices. WE choose to defy God, so there is suffering.

Just recently when i was waiting at the bus stop for my bus to school, (this happened 3 days in a row too) some bible humpers come up to me and try to preach about the lord and they give me pamphlets and try to offer me the bible... well this one lady and i had an interesting discussion about atheism... and she said "our body's are so complex, only a greater force (god) could have created them"... and i said, no lady, evolution did that... we are very much the same as an ape, just no thumb on our feet and less hair... like evolution is the answer... if you think about it our earth has been here for BILLIONS of years. is this not enough time for a single celled organism to evolve into what we see before us today? (mind you a few eras ago, we didnt even exist, so how did we all of a sudden come to "be") also in the bible, it states god first of all made adam and eve or w/e... well, he could not have made the first man due to the fact that man hasnt existed for the past 100,000 years.

That is assuming that what they teach in school is true.
So you are saying that God couldn't have made man, because man says that we have only been here for 100,000 years? interesting, I guess God is wrong then.

When i was about 11 or 12, i was having some thoughts. "if it says in the bible that god created everything, then who created god, he can not just EXIST" and "if there was a god and he created us, why would he let us suffer so much, does he get his jolly kicks out of it"... and things like that.

It explains in the Bible that god is eternal, he has no beginning and no end. No one created God, God is, has, and always will be. Pretty wild stuff, huh?
[bold]Do you mean yesterday?[/bold] God doesn't make us suffer. WE attempt to change his laws. If you live the way man was created to live, there is no suffering. People are starving in other countries when they live 50 feet from wild edible and medicinal plants.
[EDIT]the bold parts correspond.

Ever since i was a kid i was raised in a different type of environment. My cousins and mostly all immediate family were [bold]strick[/bold] christians, always going to church. I thought church to be boring. our family was different, we never went to church... i learned to swear from hearing it from my parents... and when i said those swears i got in trouble but eventually my parents gave up and now it is part of my every day vocabulary... (even though i will restrict myself from using it on these boards).

What is a strick Christian? Oh, you must mean strict. Why attempt to sound smart? Just type how you normally would, and save yourself the embarassment.
So you cuss every day and all the time. Wow, you must be really cool. I wish I could be just like you...

No one is impressed. And yes, I do resort to personal attacks to get my points across. Im not intelligent enough to do things any other way.

you dont have to talk in an [bold]intelectual[/bold] manner to get a point across, your vocabulary doesnt have to be that of a genius just to state your position.

You prove this beyond all resonable doubt. You seem to be another kid who claims to be atheist in an attempt to seem different, or special in some way. Like i said, no one is impressed with your assinine opinions, or that you sat in the cold because you hate church. So what. I sat in the cold for 4 hours and was covered in dew just to watch the beauty of the world around me. Maybe you wouldn't have had such a negative experience if you had quit moping about like an idiot and found something new to watch and learn from, as thats what you claim to be interested in(knowledge).

My parents soon saw that our young minds have been corrupted so we stopped attending our church (thank goodness).

Again, another attempt to sound cool and different. Let me guess, when you go to your school, you dress in black and try to look funny so that you can complain when the "preps" look at you funny?
To summarize my points, as people seem to find them elusive:
1:you are not different.
2:no one thinks you are cool.
3:shut up until you have something meaningful to say.

[vertigo]

I am not. Works do not get me into heaven.

Are you a good Christian?

[vertigo]

To summarize my points, as people seem to find them elusive:
1:you are not different.
2:no one thinks you are cool.
3:shut up until you have something meaningful to say.

I second that notion.

[EvenThen]

vertigo said:

Are you a good Christian?

I hate that term, 'good Christian'. Doing good things doesn't gurantee heaven. Believing the Christ is the Son of God does.

[vertigo]

EvenThen, do you readily accept that being a Christian in no way entails even the suggestion of a standard of behaviour? If so, your viewpoint is heretical.