bare
Maverick's Chew Toy
Posts: 47
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Post by bare on Mar 15, 2006 9:15:13 GMT -5
this reasoning is a beautiful work of bull
tell me guerrillasaint are you taking the trinity route with this or the he emptied himself of himself into himself while yet remaining himself in heaven and himself on earth who prayed to himself in heaven who answered himself on earth..........i'll stop now
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Post by guerrillasaint on Mar 24, 2006 12:32:43 GMT -5
Yes, but that doesn't mean that my life is just a shell of what it used to be. I have been able to do everything that I have wanted to do. Since I live for Christ what I do in this life for him will last forever.
God has said that he will give you the desires of your heart, and all I have to do is pray.
No, God still loves those who don't love him. He isn't like some of us how just love others because we they love us back. Also God is not hung up on the religions that we have made in this world. He doesn't have to live by our rules.
You can say what you want but I believe you are living with Delusions of Grandeur since you don't believe there is a God and you just happen to be here. God is talking to you you just have to expand you mind and be open to his call.
How do you know what God can and can't do. He is a God and doesn't have the limitations that we have. What you are trying to do is put God in a box. The only thing that happens when you try to put God in a box is limit yourself.
Yes I am talking about the Trinity.
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Post by vertigo on Mar 25, 2006 17:20:01 GMT -5
If we can't know what God can and can't do, we can't know what he will or won't do. In other words, the question of God is entirely irrelevant.
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Post by Dragon*of*Heaven on Mar 25, 2006 18:28:25 GMT -5
Ok Guerrillasaint I have a question. A person can be made to believe any thing as long as they either want to believe it or fear it to be true. Once you "open your mind" as you put it you are saying you want to believe it is true which violates reason. It violates reason to believe in something just because you want to. I'm very sure I could convince a man who can see perfectly that the sky is blue, if he wants to believe it it makes it simple.
Vertigo you are correct that unless you take into account what "Having a god" means. You have to understand that Having a god for these people gives them a code to live by. Truly it is a noble code in most cases, but a person cannot see the truth unless they see reason. In other words there are good reasons to "be good", but some people need more than that to function. For some the idea that there is a God is the hub in which all ideas turn. They need it. If you proscribe your self as superior or stronger than these men and women vertigo I ask you to remember what the two true meanings are to being strong. Either one you are evil and prey on the weak, or you are Good and you protect the weak. Which would you count your self?
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Post by guerrillasaint on Mar 27, 2006 1:42:57 GMT -5
I said you don't know because you have no relationship with him. You don't even believe he exist so you wouldn't know would you? But I know because he talks to me and tells me what he can do and what he will do etc.
With your reasoning you can make anyone irrelevant. You don't know what I can and can't do. Does that make me irrelevant? You only have your finite reasoning and vision about what this world is. There is so much more to this life than what you see as "reasonable".
You can also believe if you have proof. I have had proof of the existence of God. No one was in my ear telling me to believe this. I have seen it with my eyes and experienced the power of God.
What you fail to realize is not just some people need something more all people need more. Being good won't heal those wounds that life inflicts. Time won't heal it either. You need God. Some people choose to do without and I will respect that choice because it is their choice. Still everyone without God is trying to fill a God sized whole. They may just do it will status, knowledge, self indulgence or whatever they gravitate toward. Just look at society we are falling apart and have been for a very long time. So many people are limping around trying to say they can do it without God but coming up way short. You need him wither you want to admit it or not.
I want to challenge you to try it God's way and see if what I am say is wrong. I have looked at it from your point of view. I have challenged the existence of God. Why don't you ask him to show himself to you. Keep your mind open because he will show up in the way he wants to. What do you really have to lose? No one has to know but you and God.
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Post by Dragon*of*Heaven on Mar 27, 2006 16:29:20 GMT -5
This is quite the grand statement Guerrillasaint. I wonder further what leads you to this so resolutely.
No but being a good man/woman means that you are good in all ways including being responsible for the structure of your life. That is if something has injured it you must seek the person or thing that did and mend the wound, then you will be healed. Going to a God cant heal your wounds either. Only dealing with the idea, person, object, or event that hurt you can heal you. No God can just say poof your healed. Your relationship with your God Guerrillasaint is that of a loving relationship. Or at least thats what my Catholic theology class teaches. You see if you do as you are you are using your God as a crutch, and that is hardly loving. I suggest learning how to cope with your physical existence Guerrillasaint, I believe you will be much happier. ( try this approach, If you die and there is nothing then ok you wont be around to care. If there is God you can explain to him what you did and the reasons you did what you did. If your sorry you will be fine, worst you will get is purgatory. I seriously doubt that your God would be so unloving as to send a good man/woman to hell. If you live a good life you have nothing to fear. Especially not death.
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bare
Maverick's Chew Toy
Posts: 47
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Post by bare on Mar 28, 2006 8:54:10 GMT -5
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Post by guerrillasaint on Mar 28, 2006 12:09:03 GMT -5
First I know God and I listen to what he has told me. Then I pay attention to the way people live their lives. That is how I have come to my conclusions
And I think your statements was rather pompous. You are making these blind comments about who God is without knowing him.
What is the right way to structure your life? There are things that people choose not to deal with does that make them not a good person? What does being responsible for the structure of your life have to do with being good? I know there is some "bad" person out there who takes responsibility for the structure of his/her life.
The deal is some people may be living an OK life and they don't realize that I can be much better.
When do you know that you have wronged someone or you need to fix a problem in your life?What if you can't find the person you wronged or they are dead? What if you don't forgive yourself? Still your statement is sound and right the only problem is God isn't in the mix. You have only half of the situation corrected because you have wronged God in many ways. You must seek God out and correct the wrongs you have done to him, don't you? If you don't acknowledge God then you have a big chunk of you life you haven't dealt with. The more you ignore him the more wrong you do against him.
How do you know this? You don't even believe in God so why do you know he can't just poof and you are healed?
First, how is that not loving when someone helps you when you are hurting. We need a crutch because we are all hurt and need the love of God to heal us. What you fail to realize is that God will always be there. You can always come to him with your hang ups and issues. He will show you things that you never saw in yourself. I think that is the mark of someone who loves you. You act like we can do it by ourselves but we can't. You can live your normal life, but the life that God has promised will not be realized without him.
I suggest you learn how to trust in God, I don't just believe your life will be better I know that your life will be better. Also there is much more to life than the physical existence. If I just pay attention the physical there is a infinite amount of life that I would miss.
I am going to have to explain what I did on this earth to God anyway. Second there is no Purgatory. Show me where it is in the Bible and I will eat my words.
Again you don't know him so all that you say are just assumptions. Yes, God will send a Good man to hell if the Good man didn't give his life to God. He has rules he isn't some weak parent that goes OK you might have disobeyed me this whole time but you can still have your reward. There are consequences for the choices you make. My hope is that the good man's life was great because In hell it won't be that fun.
Contrary to popular beliefs death is life without God. When you don't leave in his presence then you are dead. Just a shell of what you really could be.
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bare
Maverick's Chew Toy
Posts: 47
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Post by bare on Mar 31, 2006 10:15:38 GMT -5
Contrary to popular beliefs death is life without God. When you don't leave in his presence then you are dead. Just a shell of what you really could be. you mean i could've been a child molester DAMMIT!!!
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Post by guerrillasaint on Apr 1, 2006 1:13:05 GMT -5
what does that have to do with anything I have said? Do you have to make these sad little jokes because you can't bring anything intellegent to the conversation?
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Post by Dragon*of*Heaven on Apr 1, 2006 14:13:24 GMT -5
Truely bare what did that have to do with any thing. Stop being an idiot and continue the conversation. Or if you rather be a dolt DONT CONTINUE.
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Post by vertigo on Apr 1, 2006 16:13:52 GMT -5
Bare is just having a little fun. There's no harm in it.
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Post by necroshine on Apr 6, 2006 19:50:38 GMT -5
No one can be outside gods presence. God by his definition is omnipresent. The definition is… continuously and simultaneously present throughout the whole of creation. He is everywhere even in hell and on earth. Everyone everywhere is in the presence of god all the time. Are you saying god is not omnipresent? I think it would also go to say that god could not remove himself from a spot in space. As soon as he did that he no longer is omnipresent. And if god is removing himself from places then he is no longer omnipresent and a requirement for being a god is no longer satisfied. Now if I’m wrong for assuming that god has to be everywhere all the time and you say that he is god and can do anything he wants, if your stance is that I’m incapable of understanding what god is because he is outside my understanding. Then I have to ask you why should I believe something that I can not understand? Why should I even bother? So he will not send me to hell? Who knows if he will? I say that part about him is not true. What make you know god so well that you can say he will send me to hell? We are both trying to define something you say can not be defined. But without some kind of limits even for god, how am I to know what god is?
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Post by guerrillasaint on Apr 7, 2006 16:35:07 GMT -5
If you really want to know who God is then Ask him and he will show you. If you don't ever ask him or talk to him then you will never know.
Hell is out of the presence of God and that why it will be beyond your understanding and the worst thing you ever dreamed of. We are made to be with him so when you no longer have any possibility to even be near him. ( guess in a way God would be answering your prayers to be away from him. If you don't' believe in him then you don't want to be around him and that is what hell is.)
you can be in the same room with some be never realize they are there. Still when I was saying living outside of his presents I meant leaving outside of what God wants for you.
I don't think that you are incapable of understating God because he made you to be in a relationship with him so you would have to be able to understand him.
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Post by necroshine on Apr 10, 2006 19:04:09 GMT -5
you can not live out side of what god wants for you. that doesn't make sense. you can live in a way god doesn't want. or you can go against gods will. but you saying that i'm living outside of what god wants from me doesn't sense. plus if you meant that I’m not doing what god wants, please say what you mean. this is why i say christans talk out both sides out their face. as soon as someone says something that corrects christens, then they say that is not what i meant, like you just did. now if you stand behind your statement of god not being everywhere then you are headed to hell just as fast as i am, you are calling god a liar. god calls himself omnipresent who are you to say he is not?
Are you saying that because god is not in hell then I can not understand god? Plus are you saying after a time I can not ever know god? What about all the people on there death bed calling out for god. Do you not think the people went to heaven? Are you saying god will turn his back on me? Doesn’t sound all loving to me. And god does refer to himself as all loving. Again your calling god a liar. Now allah will turn his back on you. It says that in the Koran. You sure your not a Muslim?
Been there done that and I never seen god. Never did he speak to me. I never heard a voice I never got a message, and I damn sure didn’t get a sign. I was raised to believe in god and I know when I was little I did believe in him. So you are not correct in my case. I’m the only atheist in my family everyone is christen. So I know what it is to be a christen, hell I was even close friends with two preachers sons. I helped one preacher move into his new house. I know what the church is all about. Don’t think for one second that I didn’t ask for god to speak to me. He never replied. Ever. My mom has heard voices but she has been in a mental institution to help stop the voices. I’m glad to say they are gone.
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